True picture beginning to emerge on Roberton's Riot

Post by Daniel Fontaine in


This is probably the most amazing video footage taken just prior to and during riot

It’s been exactly a week now since Vancouverites watched in horror as their city went from a “fun city” to “riot city” is less than a few hours.

With a civic election on the horizon, the stakes are very high for both Mayor Gregor and Suzanne Anton, leader of the centre-right NPA opposition party. One wrong move now and it could well affect the final outcome.

Now that we have a moment to reflect upon what happened, I thought it would be of interest to our readers if I reviewed some of the facts as we currently know them. You might refer to what follows as Robertson’s Riot for Dummies.

  1. Vancouver’s City Manager has admitted she did not read any of the reports coming out of the 1994 Game 7 Stanley Cup riots. She told CKNW news "If I had to read every single report that was behind a lot of business we do I would never see the light of day." (NOTE: it took me all of about 70 minutes to review the report from top to bottom)
  2. Vanouver’s Mayor admitted that he too didn’t read nor was he briefed about the contents of the reports coming out of the ’94 riots.
  3. Although Vancouver council debated a report last April regarding security costs for the Stanley Cup Playoffs, the decision to set up big screens, fan zones and invite 100,000 people downtown were all executive decisions made exclusively by the Mayor’s office. None of the details related to crowd control, parking restrictions, staff preparation etc…was ever debated at council or included in the staff report.
  4. It was clear in an April report that the VPD had no clue there would be a massive gathering taking place on Georgia St. only a few weeks later. The report states "given the success of the 2010 Olympics, we believe that people will again congregate in the Granville/Robson corridors."
  5. CKNW reports "the Vancouver Police watered down plans for policing the 2011 Stanley Cup Finals, a month before the playoffs even began. According to minutes from a Vancouver Police Board finance committee meeting on March 2nd, and a March 16th board meeting, the department downplayed the need for officers in the play-offs. Specifically, Inspector Rick McKenna said the need would be less than in 2010, because of "decreased momentum" and the fact the celebrations were spreading out over the Lower Mainland. A budget more than 300-thousand dollars less than what the department requested in 2010 if the Canucks made it to the finals. The meetings were months before City Hall planned outdoor viewing parties, which drew more than a hundred thousand people for Game Seven."
  6. We don’t know the exact number of officers deployed during the riot, as both the Mayor and Chief of Police refuse to release this information. This is despite the fact the independent review order by the Province will likely reveal exactly how many police were actually on duty that night.
  7. Tom Stamatakis, the head of Vancouver’s Police Union, said there were not enough officers on the street that night. He claims it would take about 5000 police to manage the crowd that amassed on the night of Game 7. This is a far cry from the reported 400-500 personnel that were allegedly on the streets of downtown Vancouver.
  8. Police Chief Jim Chu claims he was never denied resources from City Hall for additional police, but he also told local CTV news that he could have used more police officers on the night of the riot.
  9. The Mayor and Police Chief initially blamed a small group of hoodlums and anarchists bent on creating chaos for the riot. It’s now evident this theory was not based on any real evidence. Many of the young people being arrested and posting online confessions are from upstanding middle-class families. They are hardly what most people would consider as anarchists.
  10. The Mayor said he was completely “surprised” by what happened after Game 7. This is despite the fact that the last time the Canucks made it that far into the playoffs there was a major riot.
  11. As early as Game 5 police were reporting more trouble within the crowds appearing downtown. By Game 6, the Solicitor General was asked by the VPD to limit liquor sales in order to reduce issues related to public intoxication and over-consumption.
  12. Although a report was brought before council last April regarding security plans for the playoffs, it did not include any details regarding Robertson’s CBC fan zones. The location and size of the venue as well as the decision to close off Georgia Street were decisions made directly out of the Mayor’s office.
  13. In contrast, Surrey Mayor Dianne Watts chose to bring her concept of a special playoff live site to council for full debate and scrutiny. The site had a strict no alcohol policy and focused on families first. There were no major problems reported at this venue.
  14. Most of the downtown bars/restaurants which served liquor were already filled to capacity by noon. Therefore, there will little capacity for the downtown core to absorb an additional 100,000 people - with the exception of Robertson’s Georgia Street fan zone.
  15. Experts say Game 7 of a Stanley Cup final should always be treated very different from other playoff games. The dynamics of a guaranteed do or die situation is more likely to evoke emotions not seen in previous gatherings – win or lose.
  16. The Mayor says there were the same number of Vancouver Police officers on the streets as the gold medal men’s hockey game during the 2010 Olympic. What he fails to mention is that during the Olympics there were about 13,000 security personnel on Vancouver’s streets which came from a number of police forces from across Canada. It is estimated there were at most 400-500 VPD in the downtown core on June 15th.
  17. After days of facing intense media scrutiny, Robertson has finally accepted partial responsibility for what happened. But he also told the Vancouver Courier that the Vancouver Police and the Province of BC must also accept some of the blame.
  18. Chief Jim Chu has attempted to weaken the credibility of the 1994 BC Police Commission review into the 1994 riots by issuing a blistering attack letter focusing on Bob Whitelaw, one of the key individuals who worked on the report. Rather than spending time attacking Whitelaw, why don’t they just respond to his suggestions that the crowd control plan wasn’t adequate?
  19. Both Chief Jim Chu and City Manager Penny Ballem were quoted in the Vancouver Courier only hours before the riot as stating they had no concerns about a riot.
  20. A number of VPD officers have reported they were not called into duty on the evening of Robertson’s Riot. Many of them headed into the downtown core after they heard riots had broken out.
  21. Police were stationed at the major downtown SkyTrain stations earlier in the day and witnessed thousands of drunken youth heading into the downtown core. One must assume Transit Police also witnessed unruly behavior and the makeup of the crowd that headed downtown late in the afternoon.
  22. A video surfaces whereby City Manager Penny Ballem talks about her feelings regarding Stanely Cup playoff police budgets. The video is from a May 31st council meeting. Ballem states: "We have no intention of spending more than that unless we have a riot (smiles). Which I certainly hope we won't. My sense is council, I don't have a number to give you at this point. We are all working very hard to be responsible. I can give you reassurance that we are being extremely careful in what we commit to. We are trying to negotiate levered partnerships and the report that the VPD had brought forward here for information basically signaled to council that we anticipate that we are going to have to spend upwards of that range of money. My direction is that I don't think that we should have to spend that and we are trying to ratchet that back."
  23. NEW: Effective June 24th, both Penny Ballem and Chief of Police Jim Chu refuse to do any more media interviews regarding the riot. However, the Mayor sat down with Gary Mason from the Globe and Mail for a one hour interview. Robertson tells Mason “I didn’t know any details. That’s how the system is set up. … I have full confidence in the chief and the chief is responsible for that plan.” The Mayor goes on to say “I agree. I think collectively we underestimated the potential for trouble from the policing needs for Game 7, for the capacity of the live site, which got swamped that afternoon. I think the response on dealing with alcohol downtown that day, obviously there were some real issues there. There are a number of elements that clearly were not, where we were not prepared for what happened … we made mistakes in not preparing for that to happen. Therefore it got out of hand.” As for whether Robertson should accept any of the blame...he states “I do take responsibility … but that said, we do have to focus on those who committed criminal acts in terms of culpability.”


Now that we’ve reviewed the facts we know so far related to Robertson’s Riot, I think it’s also worth reviewing a few of the more interesting sections from the ’94 BC Police Commission (BCPC) Stanley Cup Riot Report. In terms of police staffing during big sporting events they state:

We also note that crowd control literature suggests that police are better served by overestimating the number of officers they will require, rather than underestimating. Cost implications make this a difficult decision, but the department should be encouraged by its budget managers to err on the side of prevention.

As we all know, Mayor Robertson’s CBC Fan Zone went from a small gathering at the broadcaster’s outdoor plaza to something much more uncontrollable. He eventually closed off Georgia Street and rented large TV screens from the United States in order to accommodate up to 100,000 in a very confined area. Interestingly the BCPC report states:

We do note that the Report of the Special Inquiry Into the Disturbances Following the Montreal Canadiens’ Stanley Cup Victory suggested that Montreal prohibit big television screen showing of such games in the downtown area.

The sentiment was expressed that the gathering of a large crowd in the downtown core, with glass store fronts and no open areas, is something our city should not encourage.

It was abundantly clear to me when I was downtown in the early afternoon on June 15th that the core of Vancouver was about to explode. On my way toward the SkyTrain in the underground Granville Station I encountered hundreds of drunken youth who shouted obscenities at me as they headed toward Robertson’s fan zone. I won’t repeat what they said, but it was clear to me the makeup of the crowd at Game 7 was nothing like early on in the series.

In fact, I noted the following in a couple of tweets I sent out early in the afternoon just prior to Game 7:

Tweet 1: Taking SkyTrain out of dwntn & just encountered thousands of young #Canucks fans heading to fan zones screaming "we want the cup"

Tweet 2: Young guy shouts on SkyTrain before leaving "be warned, there are going to be 1994 riots all over again. It's coming!" What an idiot

As for the role of alcohol might have played in Robertson’s Riot, it’s pretty clear that helped fuel the mayhem. Unsurprisingly, this is not dissimilar to what happened back in ’94. The BCPC report states:

“Many bars were full by noon”

I’ve had numerous friends tell me that locating a seat at a downtown establishment that served liquor on June 15th was next to impossible. The drinking started early, and by 5 pm thousands of drunken patrons clearly made their way onto the streets – despite the early liquor store closures.

It’s pretty clear that Mayor Gregor is absolutely terrified that he may wear some of the blame for the riots as he heads into what could end up being a close civic election.

However, regardless of what he thinks, our democratic system is fundamentally based on the principle of political accountability. Although he may not have been calling all of the shots when it comes to how the event was policed or executed, he needs to be held accountable for all the public service staff that report to him. The buck stops with the Mayor.

There is already enough evidence in the public domain to clearly indicate the Mayor and his senior team did not do their homework when it came to planning for the uniqueness of a Game 7 event. I’m pretty confident the independent review will also lead the public to that conclusion when details are released later this fall.

It is worth noting that the results of this independent review will likely come out just prior to the Coroner’s Inquest into the Pandora Street tragedy. It has been hinted that the City didn’t do enough to prevent the death of three individual who died tragically last Christmas at a flophouse in East Vancouver. Clearly the Mayor and his Vision crew are going to face a number of potential landmines as they try secure another majority mandate in November.

It would serve Robertson well over the coming months to focus less on backyard chickens and growing wheat on front lawns, and more on ensuring that citizens feel safe on Vancouver’s streets. Even then, I’m not sure his mishandling of this file will be forgotten by voters upset their city has received yet another unnecessary black eye.

- Post by Daniel. You can follow us on Twitter @CityCaucus. Or you can "like" us on Facebook at Facebook/CityCaucus.


Hopefully I am not being redundant but to reiterate my comment from June 20. Reviewing the April 2010 Stanley Cup staffing report to the VPD Board from McKenna, in games 4-7 of the finals, there were a total of 332 constables/officers per game. The total cost for Round 4 in the 2010 report was $648k. The 2011 total cost for round 4 based on 7 games was $428k. That's about a 33% reduction. Thus, there could have been as few as approx 225 deployed. In both years, Robertson was present as chair of the VPD board. In both years, it was made clear in the reports this was staffing based on available dollars in the VPD budget and on spontaneous celebrations. Thus the budgeted number was not based on Robertson frat party at the CBC fan zone. It should also be noted that both reports indicate the requested levels were minimums and the 2011 report states "that should large crowds arrive...we may need to increase the deployment." Robertson is the CEO of Vancouver and the Chair of the VPD board. He is also the only city employee on that Board while other members are appointed and paid only per diems. Why did he not make more dollars available particularly since his own frat part attracted so many more drunken louts to downtown? Why did he, as Board chair agree and accept the risks and liabilities of reduced staffing?

This is just amazing. Gregor is the Chief Constable. Penny is the City Manager. Jim Chu is Chief of Police. Ballem and Robertson are culpable for inviting 100K people into two blocks, leading to a riot.

Chief Chu is also culpable for not sounding the alarm that his officers would be put at undue risk and refuse to police it.

These are the sorts of issues that make or break politicians and civil servants. The cost to society will be in the millions, if not billions after all costs, including court proceedings, are settled.

Heads have to start to roll. Although I commend him and his force’s restraint, which ultimately lead to a relatively speedy end to the riot, Jim Chu (for whatever reason) did not sound a loud enough alarm in the days and weeks leading up to game 7. That oversight should be the end of his career with the VPD.

As chief civil servant, Dr. Ballem also needs to go. She (above any politician) could have sounded the alarm as well and denied the mayor his wish to have a massive fan zone. It was a dire mistake and for that, her career with the City should come to an end.

And finally, Mayor Gregor. His exuberance and naivety when gleefully proclaiming that there would be no riot was ultimately the guiding force that lead Chu and Ballem to toe the line. In his haste to make sure (in an election year) that he could not be called “no fun” he overlooked all of the warning signs. It will probably never be known if Ballem or Chu (off the record) advised him against the idea. Regardless of that, there was plenty of evidence that Game 7 would lead to a riot.

For his honour to have so blissfully ignored all this while watching the police budget shrink and crowds grow is not only naive, it amounts to gross negligence. Mr. Robertson should immediately resign as mayor, pending the outcome of a full, independent inquiry (not just a review, we had one of those, it was ignored).

What a great summary. Thanks for putting this together! WOW What a scandal. I sure hope Gregr is not around to plan next year's party because Canucks will be the favorite to go all the way.

The Justice Institute holds reports from VPD, the City and the Complaint Commission, on the 1994 riots. Bob Whitelaw wrote "100 recommendations." My copy of the Commission report doesn't list a single investigator or contributer, and lists only 32 recommendations, like this one: " R.26 That the Justice Institute of British Columbia provide new recruits with two to four hours of riot training, including formations and the use of riot equipment, and that
the necessary funding for this be provided by the provincial government."

The released report is shallow. Whitelaw has articulated practical solutions; he should release a copy of his report. It appears that: Commissioner Edgar preferred to rewrite VPD's whitewash.

Whitelaw might as well claim ownership; nobody else is.

The only person in this city who doesn't believe Gregor Robertson is responsible for this human tragedy is...
Gregor Robertson. Here he is cutting off debate on costs

and here are the people he invited downtown

If indeed the "fan zones" were an executive decision by the mayor then he needs to man up and accept responsibility. According to the Couriwer the crush of people in the zone was hazardous even before the riot. Its amazing nobody was killed. And for the mayor and city manager not to have read the 94 report before they embarked on this escapade is criminal.

The man has no clue and is in way over his head on this job. But he looks good and speaks well. Kind of a shallow person.

Daniel, you should add a point 22. On the day of Game 7 at the VPD Police board meeting , chaired by Mayor Robertson, there was no discussion regarding the possibility of a downtown disturbance (let alone a riot) later that day. No discussion of special precautions, extra manpower, anything. For this reason alone it is clear that the City was left with insufficient protection against the drunken young people who were wont to cause destruction in our city and that the executives and Chair of the VPD were totally unprepared. The Chief and the Mayor must resign.

They got the planning wrong.

They got the contingency plan (in the event their prediction was in error) wrong.

They got the flexible, proportionate response wrong.

And they - our elected representatives - will be in charge if there is a major earthquake.

Please revisit the planning process for massive disasters.

Let's see.

Add 100,000 people extra to the downtown party.

Don't add any additional police resources, don't change the security plan, don't debate changes with the Police Board or City council

Add large screen TV's and encourage everyone to come early to get a good seat.

Yup. Mayor Moonbeam knows exactly how to mix up the ingredients for full scale riot.

Gregor's Gamble became Robertson's Riot.

It was his event and if things had gone well, Mayor Moonbeam would have been on every TV channel and camped at Bil Good's studio claiming victory and credit.

Yes he would.

But he can only think of running, hiding and obfuscating instead of doing the politically proper thing to do and Man-Up.

Mayor Moonbean 1st, the boy child mayor who won't accept responsibility for his very bad judgement.

Because he is not a real man.

As usual, I find myself agreeing with all that you have said. I think now or in the months ahead, it would be a good thing to remind voters about the fundamental services that we pay taxes for. And about what we can and cannot afford, given the state of budgets and the struggle that most of us have with paying increased taxes at the civic and municipal level

Surely adequate policing, and public safety must be a number one priority for our civic budgets. It seems obvious to me that even when we are not hosting large events in the City, the police are struggling to keep up with all of the issues we are facing in our society.

If there are going to be any more reviews,we should be asking the question, Do we have an adequate budget for the police and is it being spent on boots on the ground?

Robertson and City council had no business encouraging people to come downtown unless the civic budget could afford the additional policing and that goes for future fun events.

Apparently Jim Chu was told that the policing had to come out of the existing budget. Ridiculous thinking for an unplanned large public event.
When families have to cut back on expenses, they tend to focus on the priorities of food, shelter, transportation and education. The fun stuff has to wait. That goes for our businesses as well. The same kind of thinking with respect to living within budgets that we can afford, needs to occur at the government level and most cities and municipalities are not getting that.

Politically, I think most people must be thinking, let's get back to the basics of running the City and at least for awhile, forget about chicken coops, urban farming and assorted other non essentials that the City of Vancouver has no business being involved in.

Most people I know are asking how these things even make the agenda in City Council let alone get passed with budgets to fund them. I think last winter's threatened closure of washrooms in the parks, something that literally thousands of tax payers use and is a basic need in a City, is a small, yet important example of how far off track the current council is in their thinking.

And it starts:

VANCOUVER (NEWS1130) - Blenz Coffee has become the first downtown Vancouver business to launch a lawsuit against the people behind last Wednesday's riot.

The Vancouver-based company is seeking compensation not only for the damage, but for the trauma rioters put the employees through.

President George Moen says it will be weeks before their location on Georgia Street will be reopened.

"Every window was broken. All of the refrigeration was broken. All of the chairs were thrown about and broken. Our expensive espresso machine was trashed. Cash registers were broken and now have to be reordered," he points out.

He says the franchisee at that location is deeply traumatized. "She was trapped along with two other staff members and customers for two and a half hours. She lost her car which was torched. She lost her business while people had fun breaking her windows."

Two other Blenz stores were hit by vandals that night.

So far no names are attached to the lawsuit, but Moen is confident it will only be a matter of time before individuals are identified. He says he's ultimately looking for financial compensation and apologies from those responsible.

I think there are questions as well about the "independent" inquiry. Who is actually engaging this third party? The province says they will pay but do they select and determine the terms of engagement? What are the terms of engagement? In the corporate world, this is how it’s done. You have a crisis. You hire a lawyer as an independent investigator. Here's the catch, privilege is attached to the terms of engagement and the results of the investigation. You, as the client, decide upon what information privilege will be waived and thus control the content of the "public" report. The independent person will not be able to compel the appearance of witnesses, compel the production of e-mails, notes etc nor compel sworn testimony. Note as well, the actual report on budgeted staffing levels was provided to the VPD at an in-camera session on March 16, 2011 so will the "independent" fact finder will have access to that information?

The Thought of The Evening

‘”There is nothing wrong with your television set. Do not attempt to adjust the picture. We are controlling transmission. If we wish to make it louder, we will bring up the volume. If we wish to make it softer, we will tune it to a whisper. We will control the horizontal. We will control the… More vertical. We can roll the image, make it flutter. We can change the focus to a soft blur or sharpen it to crystal clarity. For the next hour sit quietly and we will control all that you see and hear. We repeat: there is nothing wrong with your television set. You are about to participate in a great adventure. You are about to experience the awe and mystery which reaches from the inner mind to… The Outer Limits.’
From the ‘Outer Limits’ – 1963. A very good year indeed.

I have a confession to make.
My middle name is...Omicron.
I came in peace, a couple of decades ago...from Persei.
As an Observer.
Of the Human Race.

When my spaceship approached the planet Earth, our BMX Commander said to me 'Gliss, rest assured, we'll drop you in the Best Place on Earth. We'll come for you in one year, two years tops.'

My thoughts now, after twenty?

'I hope you die of space vacuum outside the Milky Way you madafakkaaaa! And I hope you'll do it in a cacophony of screams and gasps, spasmodically exposing your veins and eyeballs soon to bulge in a clearly disagreeable manner. You! You, over inflated baboon, I wish you'll end up in a gruesome spray of blood...'

Well, yeah, maybe I overreacted there a bit, but yeah, this would be about right, me greeting my Commander... today, after abandoning me, here, in the best place on Earth.'

Here is one story that is striking in similarities, well not exactly but it would serve as good background for explaining the Animal Gene in Humans.

Maple Ridge Rave.
People. Lots of People.
Unorganized Party.
Unsupervised Party.
Booze. Drugs. Booze.
The MOB - Drunk Males Gang.
The Victim - Drugged Female.
Drunk Audience. Both Sexes.
Gang Rape. Cheers.
Passive Audience with Cellphone Cameras and more... Cheers.
Twitter, Facebook.
Victim Blamed!
MOB Non-Apologetic.
MOB Not Accepting Responsibility.
Nobody Assuming Responsibility.
No Human Activity Detected.


Forward 10 months. Vancouver. Game 7.
Booze. Drugs...
MOB. Different MOB...same MOB!?
No Human Activity Detected.


Just in case I'm not surviving the eventual extraction from Earth (I'm still hoping though)I left a short message for the next generation of Persei Explorers.
One Aluminum tube, one piece of paper inside, one word written:

'Run!' - Glissando Omicron Remmy

We live in Vancouver and this keeps us busy.

OMG Glissando,

I had forgotten about this..

we have a generation of children out of control with no moral compass, very violent..

trouble is brewing in our society, and we are foolish to ignore longer do we have accountability, or impulse control...

we have a generation of citizens unwilling to take responsibility for their respect for each other...or themselves..

No role models for them to look up to..

Wait... the youth do respect Gregor.. a man that lies, cheats, won't take responsibility for his mistakes, or actions...there is a perfect example of where society is headed..

All under the guise, and sanctimony of saving the planet...sad, very sad...

Well done Glissando...

Gliss, you always find a way to say it that eclipses even my wildest thoughts - you are truly brilliant. Don't let anyone talk you into entering politics - it will destroy your mind. I believe you are far more effective shouting from the sidelines.

to your point - it would be far to simple to consider the Game 7 riot as an isolated incident and you have done well to remind us that it is happening every day, all around us, perhaps in a smaller scale but it is happening none the less.

The social media genie is out of the bottle. Smartphone manufacturers are not about to take photographic equipment off their devices any time soon, and there is far to much brand value given to things like YouTube and Facebook(remember, these are money making enterprises)to curtail or discourage such outrageous behaviour.

All we can hope for is a very large horrified pause from those that create media, and those that raise children and those that are trying to grow up in a society that seems to have lost its way.

I watched a Youtube video of this 3-4 year old boy mimicking a scene from Glee. Very cute. But what would have happened if the scene was violent or destructive from another show? Mom and Dad were applauding and laughing and egging him on. How is that child supposed to know which behaviour is funny and which behaviour is anarchy?

I do not totally fault these kids that are in trouble. They are wandering without guidance, without a society that sets standards. We have folks like PIVOT Legal that says you should be able to do anything you want. We have media that plays up mayhem without consequences. Its the grown ups that are setting up these kids for grief.

Did you happen to hear the Molson's long weekend road trip ad this week? They are selling extra beer for the same cost so you have a sufficient stash for your holiday weekend 'road trip'. Oh yay - driving, extra beer, long weekend. Glad I am staying home and playing in my back yard. Who wants to be on the road with a Molson's Road trip!

I remain hopeful. My friends have a daughter that graduated this weekend. She won the citizenship award at her school, she can speak in sentences, she wants to be a nurse, she respects others and most importantly, she respects herself. I consider her a friend. Kudo's to Mom and Dad.

If there is one shining star - I am hopeful there is more. We just need to look.

Respect, the key word in your comment.

It has been lost and that has led to situations where even relatively calm people (like myself-most of the time) have lost their tempers.

Bureaucracy, passing the buck, down right lying from many of our authorities.

Is it any wonder that many of the people in our society are floundering.

Even adults.

We need to have a 'respect' movement.

And what example is set by civic leaders in Vancouver. Robertson now hides behind the "independent" inquiry as a reason to refuse to answer questions. Why should we expect teenagers and early twenty something’s to show more character, courage and responsibility when the Mayor of the city obfuscates, evades and now hides behind the "independent" inquiry he established to investigate his own decisions made as the CEO of Vancouver and the Chair of the Police Board.

Respect - you are absolutely correct.

We don't respect other people's stuff, we don't respect other people's ideas, we don't respect other people's right to live peacefully, we don't respect the right to live in a civil community, we don't respect authority...and the list goes on.

The religion of entitlement and no consequences is destroying our society.

Glissando Remmy...simply beautiful.
The way you bring up a subject and make your point is out of this really must be from the outer space. :-)Thank you.
I am totally agreeing with George and Julia. I also think that politics could benefit enormously from your wisdom.
Why let only the idiots and the corrupt individuals to make decisions for us?
Or in this case, in Vancouver...not being able to make any? Well done Glissy!

You state in your About Us that "Our goal here is to have a fun, but respectful dialogue ... providing comments that stick to the issues, and do not stoop to name-calling or personal attacks.".

By labeling this Roberton's Riot (sp); stooping to name-calling is exactly what you are doing. This leads me to question the sincerity of your cause and wonder how much this is all just about furthering your own political agenda.

Too bad, because you make some very good points.

name calling... you're kidding right?

The Thought of The Dark Night

'500 years have passed,but it seems like we are still lost in the Dark Ages.'

George, Julia, Michelle,
Thanks for your kind words. Too much.

What can I say.
Many years ago I received an art book with the works of the Dutch painter Hieronymus Bosch. A very dark period in time to live in, believe me.

Hieronymus imagery is fantastic, illustrating the moral and religious concepts of the time. His narratives are gruesome. But so I believe was the life then.

I came across this site wich contains most of his tablets (he used to paint on wood):

If you have the time, check them out. I'll challenge you to tell me which one better depicts last week's riot.
500 years of evolution, yet 1000 years from now the pictures taken last week will be remembered as 'the gruesome pictures' from the Cellphone Ages.

We live in Vancouver and this keeps us busy.

Today's Globe has an interview with Robertson in their Saturday edition and I have to say it is truly amazing.

He is saying that he went to Chu to find out how many cops were at the riot and Chu refused to tell him and he came away empty.


Doesn't Chu worked for Robertson. I thought he might escape this one a few days ago but stuff like this points towards him getting a size 12 boot in the butt in November if not earlier.

I just read that the CEO of Tourism Vancouver has said that the implications of our image abroad will outweigh the implications locally.

I beg to disagree.

Those of us who live in Vancouver, want our children to grow up to be mature individuals, want safe communities, have had something major taken away from us.

Business interests cannot be the only focus.

The Thought of The Day

'Mayor Robertson doesn't need to worry for a request from his significant other to undergo a vasectomy. His balls are...ornamental anyway.'

Or, maybe Gregor doesn't know how to ask a policeman...

The degree of incompetence shown by this Vision & friends gang, the complete disregard for public safety, the moronic misuse of public money, and the extent to which they are willing to go to cover it all up, is mind-boggling.

We live in Vancouver nad this keeps us busy.

A video surfaces whereby City Manager Penny Ballem talks about her feelings regarding Stanley Cup playoff police budgets. The video is from a May 31st council meeting. Ballem states: "We have no intention of spending more than that unless we have a riot (smiles).

Let's face it if she knew how this whole thing would explode after game 7 she would have given the cops what they wanted and Ballem would have personally assisted police by giving them direction.

Oh wait a minute Ballem was down there giving the cops direction..........and her qualified opinions.

Did anyone read the article in today's Sun by Jeff Lee.

Council weighed cost, spirit over security, manager says..

I always knew that Gregor Robertson works as hard as two people. I didn't expect those to be Stan and Olly. That clip was hilarious, and soooooo Gregory!

Check out!

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